C++ vs java vs Python vs X for beginners (and for work)

pumkinhead

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I'm considering to start working in the IT sector (as QA). I had some nice experience with C++, but I have no knowledge of the other languages. Would you guys give some advice/thoughts on the subject?
 
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Uberto F

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Isn't QA just a fake corporate term for bug tester? I think your job will be more about writing reports than writing code.
 

pumkinhead

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Isn't QA just a fake corporate term for bug tester? I think your job will be more about writing reports than writing code.
They tell me I'll be supposed to make the programs for the bug tests + some other shit like that. According to the course + some other comments I should know some of every type of programmer's coding/work.
 

Lurk

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just curious, you wouldnt by chance be looking at QA in relation to 'interactive multimedia' would you?
 

pumkinhead

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just curious, you wouldnt by chance be looking at QA in relation to 'interactive multimedia' would you?
Sadly I haven't considered it that far (mostly considered aps/production programs/other simple math internet programs). Why?
 

Uberto F

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If you're dealing with internet apps you'll want to learn Java and PHP
 

Reverend Lulzcraft

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If you're dealing with internet apps you'll want to learn Java and PHP
Why Java? Does anyone even use applets anymore?

OP, C/C++ is probably the best to know for computer programming. Learn that in-depth and then assembly; from there, the other stuff is easy and/or just variations of what you already know.

For web development, PHP, JavaScript, and HTML5 are good.

Between those five, you've got most of your bases covered.
 

Uberto F

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Why Java? Does anyone even use applets anymore?

OP, C/C++ is probably the best to know for computer programming. Learn that in-depth and then assembly; from there, the other stuff is easy and/or just variations of what you already know.

For web development, PHP, JavaScript, and HTML5 are good.

Between those five, you've got most of your bases covered.
Telling someone with minimal coding skills to learn ASM and C++ is like telling a baby to fly a jumbo jet.

Also yes Java is still very popular in business applications. Not sure why you'd want to learn HTML5 unless you are developing websites. Might as well throw CSS on that list of everything.

Also what purpose does knowing ASM have unless you plan on cracking software. Your suggestions are confusing and misinformed.
 
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lotic

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I highly recommend learning either Python or Java first; they are both easy languages to grasp and have massive support communities. Java also forces you to understand object oriented programming, which is very prevalent.

Why Java? Does anyone even use applets anymore?

OP, C/C++ is probably the best to know for computer programming. Learn that in-depth and then assembly; from there, the other stuff is easy and/or just variations of what you already know.
Knowing C is far less necessary than it used to be, but learning assembly is almost useless now.

The only people who need to know assembly are people trying to modify programs with no available source, and people working on very specific applications for embedded systems. It is nothing like C or any other language, and it takes years to become comfortable with it, let alone proficient.

The idea of recommending assembly to a beginner who works in QA is ridiculous.
 

Reverend Lulzcraft

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I highly recommend learning either Python or Java first; they are both easy languages to grasp and have massive support communities. Java also forces you to understand object oriented programming, which is very prevalent.



Knowing C is far less necessary than it used to be, but learning assembly is almost useless now.

The only people who need to know assembly are people trying to modify programs with no available source, and people working on very specific applications for embedded systems. It is nothing like C or any other language, and it takes years to become comfortable with it, let alone proficient.

The idea of recommending assembly to a beginner who works in QA is ridiculous.
I recommended C first, and then assembly.

More people need to fucking learn assembly. The fact that nobody is learning it is killing game piracy and cracking. It is anything but useless.

Anyways, my point is, if you know all of those things I mentioned, then learning anything else is cake. There's almost nothing you'll come across in other languages that aren't in those.

Anyways, I'm not proficient in assembly, myself, but it took a few weeks to learn the basics, which is all I'm recommending to OP. It helps to know how things operate behind the scenes.

Telling someone with minimal coding skills to learn ASM and C++ is like telling a baby to fly a jumbo jet.

Also yes Java is still very popular in business applications. Not sure why you'd want to learn HTML5 unless you are developing websites. Might as well throw CSS on that list of everything.

Also what purpose does knowing ASM have unless you plan on cracking software. Your suggestions are confusing and misinformed.
Yeah, forgot CSS. I did already clearly state that HTML5 (along with PHP and JavaScript) is for people who want to learn web development.

And Jesus Christ, what a bunch of fucking pussies in the development world today. C++ is easy as fuck to learn; you don't need any prior experience for that.

ASM is hard, but not *that* hard. A couple weeks dedication and you'll have the basics down, at least. The shit's not rocket science. Start by learning to code for the c64 or something; even if the code isn't portable at all, once you have the basics of one instruction set down, it's not so hard to wrap your head around the others. ASM is weird as fuck and complicated as shit, but it's not that terribly different than using a compiled language otherwise. I wouldn't want to have to write a decent program in it, but I feel like it's good to know how it works, because you will come across it.

Is good for cracking software, yeah, but it's also good for plenty of other stuff: writing homebrew for unfamiliar hardware, making retro games, ROM hacking, playing around with operating systems...
 

ilovejesus69

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I highly recommend learning either Python or Java first; they are both easy languages to grasp and have massive support communities. Java also forces you to understand object oriented programming, which is very prevalent.



Knowing C is far less necessary than it used to be, but learning assembly is almost useless now.

The only people who need to know assembly are people trying to modify programs with no available source, and people working on very specific applications for embedded systems. It is nothing like C or any other language, and it takes years to become comfortable with it, let alone proficient.

The idea of recommending assembly to a beginner who works in QA is ridiculous.
Pretty much this ^

If you have all the time in the world, C++ is a great language to learn because you'll understand lots of best practice techniques like organizing your code and making it as clean and simple as possible. C++ is extremely powerful but if you don't have time to master its nuances, you're better off learning something simpler and more forgiving, as it can be a frustrating thing to learn quickly.

If you're strapped for time, Python and Java are definitely the best to start off with. It's easy to stay motivated to learn when you're getting actionable results quickly, which both provide.

Whoever said no one uses Java is on crack. Java is one of the most widely used programming languages.
 

lotic

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I recommended C first, and then assembly.
Anyways, my point is, if you know all of those things I mentioned, then learning anything else is cake. There's almost nothing you'll come across in other languages that aren't in those.
That's like saying learning basic arthimetic is easy once you become comfortable with multivariable calculus and discrete mathematics.

Most people, especially beginners, can't be expected to do the latter without first learning the former.
 

Uberto F

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It takes years to learn to comprehend Assembly and even longer to become proficient at it.

There used to be a place for it back when developers needed direct hardware access to make good programs. Doom and Doom 2 use Assembly in some of its subroutines to speed up the gameplay. Now days processors are fast enough that it's not needed.

It would take 1000 lines of ASM to accomplish what you can do with 10 lines of C or 1 line of Java. It's simply impracticable unless your job is finding exploits or writing malware.
 

Reverend Lulzcraft

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Pretty much this ^

If you have all the time in the world, C++ is a great language to learn because you'll understand lots of best practice techniques like organizing your code and making it as clean and simple as possible. C++ is extremely powerful but if you don't have time to master its nuances, you're better off learning something simpler and more forgiving, as it can be a frustrating thing to learn quickly.

If you're strapped for time, Python and Java are definitely the best to start off with. It's easy to stay motivated to learn when you're getting actionable results quickly, which both provide.

Whoever said no one uses Java is on crack. Java is one of the most widely used programming languages.
No I'm not... Not right now.

For web development, though? The person I was responding to specifically said Java is a necessity for web development, and I don't even remember the last time I saw a Java applet or a JHTML page. Maybe it's different in the corporate world; I know Java is used for plenty of things, but I haven't heard much about it in web development since 2010 or so. (Not that I've been around much since 2010 or so.)

If I'm wrong about that, then, apologies.

How the fuck is C++ harder to learn than Java, or produce results less quickly? I always considered C++ easier. Plus, with C++, there's no bulky interpreter. But they're not that different syntax-wise, and C++ is the better of the two.


C++ > Java
 

Reverend Lulzcraft

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That's like saying learning basic arthimetic is easy once you become comfortable with multivariable calculus and discrete mathematics.

Most people, especially beginners, can't be expected to do the latter without first learning the former.
You have to know basic arithmetic before you can learn advanced math. You don't have to know fucking Python before you learn C++. If you want, you can start out with ASM. There used to be a time where you *had* to because there were no coddling interpreted languages with forgiving syntax.

C++ is not that fucking hard. I can't do calculus, but I started learning with Perl and C++.

ASM is fucking hard. But not as fucking hard as you're making it out to be. Learning the basics is something any beginner can do, and, again, that's all I'm recommending.
 
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